See [vems.hu/android] (often used with [bluetooth-RS232 adapter] if you have an android device (2014-07-15.apk has gauge editor now as users requested (for custom settings like max speed, max kPa, etc...)
Works with all device/android-fw versions we could test in the meantime)
- 1.2.x v3 firmware recommended
- because the advanced CRC-protected "triggerframe protocol" used in 1.2.x can protect against erroneous corruption (of config and tables inside the controller !) (note: the old megatune-type unprotected comm-protocol is obsolete, and intentionally unavailable since 1.2.3x firmwares)
- triggerframe-mode No special configuration needed in v3 (just don't enable v3 password-protection, and check that VemsTune communication works). Triggerframe mode requires 2-directional connection:
- both DSUB9/pin2 and DSUB9/pin3 are used => Only 1 device can be connected at this time: directly, or through bluetooth or wifi or ser2net or other TCP relay: A rather simple software cache-patch of ser2net or our existing TCP relay would allow 'forked' connections to multiple display devices.
- for AIM-mode to work, AIM-mode must be enabled in v3 config (in "display settings") so that v3 automatically starts sending/broadcasting AIM packets after boot (it's a one-way stream from v3 => any number of devices that understand AIM-protocol)
- for non-android PDA: see PdaCockpit
- Displays / dashes that support the 5-byte AIM protocol (through serial) can be connected in a similar way like the [VEMS-Round with aim-firmware uploaded]
- the AIM protocol has a notable advantage: since it's 1-directional "broadcast" type, it can be easily sent to arbitrary many devices with passive components ( wires, or simple buffers if long wires or more than 10 devices are hooked up ).
The rest of this page is developer brainstorming reloated to graphical displays
No HW designed because full ARM + display was always lower cost than just the display. Some 2016 notes:
- Androids (tablet / phone) very common.
- Orange PI-PC 1GByte, 4core, HDMI+PAL out (comparable price and performance with android tablets)
- max 50C ambient (70C specified, but very careful install would be needed above 60C)
- also better for large displays (HDMI 7..15..50 inch)
- also better for interfacing with wired or realtime systems (SPI, I2C, multiple serial, GPIO, IR, analog audio); 4 * real USB ports (unfortunately USB sucks mechanically; The B-type connector sucks less than the others, but only used in printers)
- also allows android, with the option of easier customization for full (non-android) OS
- fast boot (say, under 12 sec) ? Full screen splash screen (no scrolling text) ? RO (not writing to filesystem) ? Round-robin boot-entry (for self-healing after reboot if one of the images get corrupted) ? Opengl helps reasonable VemsTune logviewer performance ? How easy are these ? Gentoo or debian jessie is less work to start from ?
- debian is prolly easier to install, actually very easy; Fast-boot beyond a certain point is probably easier with gentoo
Low-cost Androids, PDAs, notebooks (and sometimes dash-displays) make custom-designed HW unfeasible.
0.92kg Asus EEEPC 701-4G-BK057 LINUX (appr 250 EUR + VAT at 2008-05) is the practical minimum to run a full-featured [VEMS-Tune]
- 10" (1024x600 VemsTune is often used on EEE-PC in this resolution)
- 7" WVGA (800x480 resolution is a bit low)
- internal Webcam and mic
- ideal for skype and VOIP-ing in the city WLAN: 802.11b/g and Ethernet (RJ45) 10/100
- 512 MB RAM (in 2012 rather 1024 MB or more)
- (Solid-State Disk option): 4-8GB NO mechanical hard-drive that fails in racecars
- 3 x USB 2.0
- 1 x VGA (for external monitor)
We now have a professional partner that might be suitable for the mechanical manufacturing and assembly. Needs more investigation
We still investigating costefficient PDA / PAL / or other display options that could be used
The market is flooded by 100 USD color display (maybe 400x300 or 640x480 or around that resolution, with reasonable display size) with PAL/NTSC input (note that these don't have touchscreen which is bad for interaction)
It seems very hard to find a suitable dumb display (TFT and / or touchscreen) for the cost of the PAL-input display
Note that there are 3 possible solutions:
- custom mask display. Postponed for now. Setup costs might be acceptable, but design and management seems prohibitive. 2 custom-mask displays (for the most often needed functions) and a generic full-matrix (that can be customized and mode-switched) would make upa a good dash
- we also avoid composite input displays (very popular nowadays, appr $100). Needs a videochip and a PAL coder
- though with today's DSP power software PAL-coder and 8bit 20Msps video-DAC can be an option as well
- LVDS input displays cost more than PAL. Quality is better. Making and LVDS output videocard costs appr same as a PAL output.
- If bare display, adding ARM garnish requires several months
- there are displays with drivers and display without drivers, right ?
- we might choose a ready-to-go PDA (that has serial port: USB device only is not good), like
- IPAQ rz1710 seems to be the minimal suitable PDA, appr 138 EUR is half of the cost of the GPS-wifi capable fujitsu-siemens PDA we currently use. (we neglected any PDA below 320x240 display), but IPAQ rz1710 only has IRDA communication. The Serial-IRDA communication must be examined (might require some software changes for more robust communication). Any serial-IRDA software and HW hints ?
- [ GP32] is probably the best fit today with 320x240 color display and gaming style input paddles But too small display
- Nintendo GBA (display is a bit too small: 240x160). Not only small display, but very hard to program because of the low memory.
- Sharp Zaurus
Race-guys are very concerned about visibility and size. Often color or grayscale is secondary to them (1 bit BW is enough). Visibility counts.
The software (guts) should be almost the same, regardless of the HW.
http://www.elatecworld.com distributor showed up, they would like to sell us displays. But their site is hard to search, in fact they don't have own products, just import. The referred manufacturers are no easy ride either.
- Besides the plain TFT / LCD-s - TODO: list of suitable products
- they sell a round RPM-display (relatively big, as you expect from a car's factory RPM display):
- [GDE017SP] from XIAMEN OCULAR that we could also use.
A farnell candidate (display with controller):
If anyone has good candidates, please take a note. If you know prices (we'd buy 100+) that's even better.
- Displays http://www.fractronics.com/128x64bla.shtml
- Displays http://store.earthlcd.com/LCD-Products
- graphical display software http://www.ramtex.dk/
- graphical display software http://www.easygui.com/default.asp?page=productinfo
- http://www.powertip.com.tw/product/pro_grap.asp Powertip claims to have 640x480 too, but where ? Apparently not on this product list.
- http://www.mscbp.hu/arlista/arlista.htm The TFT-LCD section has a nice display:
- for those who cannot read [ArmDisplay WIKI (Hungarian language)]
- [PXA270 Xscale developer board for appr. 100 EURO] - or is it rather 180 EURO ?
- http://www.linkecu.com/products/TuningTools/DisplayLink 320x240 black and white
- Who wants to play with these chips (currently in HU, EU) ? We purchased a while ago, lack of time, noone played with them yet. How many do you need ?
- 3 pieces of S1D13506F00A200 (128-QFP Epson LCD driver)
- 10 pieces of M41T00M6E (SOIC-8 RTC-I2C serial)
what displays we've got now is:
- MegaTune and MegaTunix tuning apps (see DocsPage) running on notebooks
- directly connected alphanumeric LCD: GenBoard/BuildProcedures/LCDconnect
what we'll have for sure:
- extended tuningsoftware for notebooks: OtherTuningSoftware
- logging and display (and tuning possibility, wether useful or not) software for PDAs: OtherTuningSoftware
- round 52mm diameter unit with LED displays: 3*7 segment and 24 LED bar
- bigger LED display for HUD application: at least 3 LEDbars and 3*3*7 segments and several status-LEDs.
other ideas that came up
- graphical LCD
- CRT (TV)
http://www.amulettechnologies.com/products/products.html Easy GUI, uses HTML
Note that developers are strongly against these.
- Simply because there are other areas of development that appear to be more useful.
- these are useless before we have some prototype for displaying the data (which is effectively a major part of OtherTuningSoftware for PDA )
- after we have OtherTuningSoftware for PDA these bring very little extra, so efforts are hard to justify. Even if the units are cheap, the development overhead is not.
PAL output, for using off-the-shelf PAL-input display
- $100 OTS display, that operates on 12v (this also opens up the use of a VCR in the car to visually record data)
- device with PAL output
Circuit Cellar has several articles, one uses a micro to generate TV sync while also doing real processing, free compiler for this, another article by Fred Eady, duplicates an LCD, uses a pic, 5370xxxOSD IC, maybe the little Atmel micro could replace the PIC. This is probably not feasible for a nice solution
how to make a device with PAL output? - usually called "video card"
- an ARM and an offtheshelf video chip on a PCB. Chip candidates:
- some chips like the Nvidia FX5200 or FX 400, whatever (any recent chips used in PC) CONTAIN on-chip processor. This way we need no ARM processor at all, only add SRAM and output protection
- this would be a killer combination, but:
- integration is no gravy train: we might be unable to get programming docs for the videochip
- these chips dissipate a lot of heat. Probably work well for us with low clock freq
- the PCI/AGP interface is not used at all, the pins just eat space
- getting the chips might not be easy either
We need to make OtherTuningSoftware work on PDA first. Programming on nvidia proc sounds a bit steep. But not impossible.
Please evaluate the video solution (cost/complexity/possible chips) to emit true-color PAL signal
- [AVR MOSI mono video signal] just as useless for a real display, as caraca for real networking, but interesting
Sorry I write or explain what trying to say so poorly. Qne of the articles simply details how to make the TV display a picture like an LCD, LCD EMULATION.
(I think I understand, and it seems it is effectively useless until we have a PDA display app).
It effectively replaces an LCD module, Just plug into what would normally drive an LCD subsystem.
(just plug it in wouldn't be useful, even if it worked that way. It needs to be defined what should be displayed and how!)
You can then record it on VCR, camcorder etc.
Small TV's can be bought here for less than $20.00.
(OK, that unit price is compelling, but the development costs are not).
Nothing to do with PDA, just another adaptive display, several area flea markets sell a 5x7 color video display for less than $70.
(yes, it has a lot to do with PDAs! We cannot use that for anything before we have a working app, which will surely work on a PDA next. After we have the display code - might be just 3 days if someone really sits down - we could think if we put the 8000 Euro worth of development effort into driving a CRT or if we can find something more useful.)
A list of graphical modules
I think this can be somewhat cheaper if we buy many.
It cannot compete with Nintendo prices, but even a 320x240 can fit our budget.
Could someone look up in datasheet how hard to drive these ? Most are handled by: Procyon AVRlib with MMC, FAT, IP, graphic lcd support and lots more http://hubbard.engr.scu.edu/embedded/avr/avrlib/
240 Ft = 1 EURO = 1.3 USD
EW12A03FLY SED1520 122x32 graphic LCD 3 300 Ft EW13B10FEW ? 128*64 grafikus fehér hát 4 700 Ft EW13B10FLY HD61202 128*64 LED háttér 4 000 Ft EW13B30BMW ? 128x64 Graphic Blue/White 4 440 Ft EW24B00BCW T6963C 240*64 CCFL kék háttér 13 400 Ft EW24B00GLY T6963C 240x64 graphic LCD w/ LED 12 700 Ft EW24B00YLY T6963C 240x64, Green,STN,LED BL 9 100 Ft EW24D00FLY LC7981 240x128 LCD vezérlõ + LED 14 500 Ft EW24D30FLY T6963C 240x128 graphic LCD 9 800 Ft 108X58mm active display. EW24D40FDW LC7981 240x128 grafikus LCD 13 400 Ft EW24D70NCW T6963C 240x128 graphic LCD CCFL 12 600 Ft 120X64mm active display http://www.mitsutech.com.tw/spec/ew24d70ccfl.pdf EW32F10BCW SED1335 not onboard QVGA blue/white ccfl 11 000 Ft EW32F10NCW SED1335 not onboard LCD 320*240, CCFL 12 600 Ft EW32F40FLW no info on controller LCD 320*240, LED, SED1335 17 300 Ft EW32F40NCW SED1335 onboard 320x240 graphic LCD CCFL 18 300 Ft 115X86mm active display EW32F90FLW SED1335 not onboard LCD 320*240, LED, no IC 8 900 Ft EW32F92FLW 320x240 graphic LCD w/TP 15 000 Ft EW32FA1FLW 12 900 Ft EW32FA3FLW 320x240 FSTN White BL 12 800 Ft EW50080FLW 128x64 graphic LCD white 6 900 Ft
Some very nice LCD panels can be found here:
I know more TFT LCD monitor developer, so from 1,8" TFTs to 15" in-car TFT's we can offer a lot of types. Some modells with VGA input and with touchscreen.
Prices from 50USD, all modells over 100k pixels and has video signal input, full colours etc.
The avarage price is 80-100 USD for a 7-8", there is standalones, in-dashes, etc
Emil received an x-mas deal for 8" 640x480, 675 sek + VAT
I looked at LCD to make a motorbike dashboard some time ago but temperature range was a little problem on TFT.....so i decides to use a small 160x80 monochrome lcd (with extended range).
I used only 320x240 with a SED1375 controller ... is't very fast compared with other lcd with onboard-controller.
- 187445-11 (link wont work ,put this number in the search field.) 109,00 EUR for "GRAFIK 240X128 LCD-MODUL" black and white. Much better display is needed for 109 Euro. To justify 15..25000 Euro development costs something spectacular is needed 400+ of which can be selled of.
- lacks datasheet. Unknown temprange. (some technical data http://www2.produktinfo.conrad.com/datenblaetter/175000-199999/187445-da-02-en-Grafikdisplay_240x128.pdf
ARM display board - pressing ahead
For something we can make now with parts that are good for other things and cheap, I have put into schematics:
- Atmel ARM9 (SAM)
- Epson S1D13506, Digikey has 1000
- PSU for 12V
- MMC, RAM, Flash
- CRT, LCD and TV connectors(S-video/composite)
- NO point in arguing about the LCD module right now, we can find the BEST one later
Basically an SBC, will run linux and start GUI from MegaTunix Code. Or some wx-widget code.
Any more ideas?
Our partners make high quality 4 layer PCBs, batch starting costs are appr 200 EUR and 3 weeks so it's best to get right within a few iterations ;-)
High speed buses ... that is a design problem I guess. 8 mil clearance (and 8 mil traces, with 12 mil drill) is cheapest, but 6 mil is certainly possible without too high extra cost, I can ask how costs increase under 6 mil. But with rounded corner pads it should not be needed.
I have an idea: LCDash
Instead of reinventing the wheel, there already is a solution to your problem here... There just needs to be some development here. I have already emailed the owner about if his LCD project can support VEMS, he said it would be no problem just some firmware needs to be written for it. He also said he has tried contacting someone here (Jason Russell) to try to get a test unit to program for it with?
I suggest looking into this: [LCDash]
Jason's concern with this is only timing right now. We want to drop Megatune compatibility soon, so there's no reason to add another device that uses the stupid protocol. Sami has VEMS-Tune running on a GPS unit with similar functionality. (See PdaCockpit toward the bottom) We really want to use SIPR (our own protocol) or AIM protocol for something like this.
I have a question about the LCD control of the current V3.3 boards... I was doing a little digging and it seems that most of what I've found is also said in here...
A graphical LCD like this: CFAG12864I Series Graphic LCD, KS0107/KS0108 Compatible Controller
can be controlled through the use of Procyon's AVRlib, as it has support for the KS0108. But looking at the data connections on the board for the current LCD it seems only 4 databit connections are available? But from what I can make out 8 is needed for a graphical display? How would this be solved? Add-on board? or pick up directly from the atmega128?
http://www.crystalfontz.com/products/index-grph.html (for easy reference)
[IOIO-RTG] could be interesting for android IO and ADC extension. Perhaps useful for some indication lights, or selecting screen (without touchscreen) with rotary switch, or similar.